RE: Peel Ply
Jeff That is correct. For the finish the mylar is left on until fully cured.
Posted on: 11/2/2009 5:10 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9223158

RE: Alright I got another .15 sized one built, simpler this time
how did it fly?
Posted on: 10/31/2009 1:32 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "S.P.A.D. Aircraft - Coroplast design"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9216878

RE: Bungee/Hi-start rubber
Hosemonster[:D] I like my hose monster set up very well.
Posted on: 10/30/2009 5:01 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9215751

RE: Dynaflite Butterfly tricycle gear conversion???
Wheels on a Butterfly is kinda like dualies on a Mini Cooper. Perhaps a launch cradle would be the best of both worlds???
Posted on: 10/30/2009 4:58 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9215735

RE: DO you have a crashed plane you dont want?
I would consider doing Spads for them. Cost could be near zero not counting motor and radios. I would look at SPADTOTHEBONE.COM for free plans The Debonair would be a great first plane for anyone. Better yet try this http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1116932
Posted on: 10/30/2009 2:10 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Crash & Rebuild"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9214264

RE: Peel Ply
What Ed said, Often the LE is glass or Kevlar covered first. A little sanding maybe required to smooth out where the Mylar ends. There are tricks to keep the LE covering in place. One popular trick from Mark Drela is 3M77 spray adhesive and an ironing, after it has been in place long enough to be dry, to make it tack well to the foam LE. The mylars are trimmed to be just shy of the LE. Some even scrape or sand the mylar edges(on the top side to keep the inside smooth) to get it to wrap and come closer to the LE. The guys that are good at this wax the contacting surface of the Mylar a few times and apply the finish paint to the waxed surface. The paint bonds to the epoxy and and becomes he final finish. A close look at some of these finished parts show no paint or color on the LE. It comes darn close though. post #75 in RCGroups Sailplane/thermal forum "Another Supra Build - the slow way" addresses this issue by builders with oodles of experience. If you want to try composite building reading that build log isn't a bad learning experience IMHO.
Posted on: 10/28/2009 4:50 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9209925

RE: Peel Ply
Ok I suggest you read the thread mentioned previously, or any build threads on hand launchgliders, Supras or the Alegro Lite. Builders are reducing weight using this method. Sometimes they just put the wetted out kevlar or CF on plastic with an absorptive layer and vac it dry prior to application to a wing or before rolling a boom, sometimes its done on the wing or tail surface. I didn't invent this step. I simply wondered if useing peel ply would make removing the paper towel easier. This is a quote from post #41 in RCGroups "another Supra build - the slow way" " Skipping some steps... After wetting out both sides of the fin, and scraping... I wanted a dry layup. I placed a 2 paper towel between both mylars (with kevlar), put them in the vacuum bag for a few minutes. The paper towels soak extra resin." Here is a pic of his paper towel after absorbing the extra epoxy. This is a common practice among sailplane and hand launch composite builders. You guys are spot on wondering about pulling up the fiber glass or Kevlar in this case. They have very carefull methods for getting the towel off. I apolgize if I caused any confusion.
Posted on: 10/27/2009 12:29 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9201768

RE: Peel Ply
Lets use a little common sence here. Of course when the piece goes back in the bag it would have all layers including mylar and breather. The epoxy /weight reduction step I have brought up is common in several build threads including one for booms by a builder I respect. Just trying to share some info here. Didn't want to offend anyone.
Posted on: 10/25/2009 6:04 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9201267

RE: Peel Ply
Hey Gang, yep it is a little tricky to remove the absorption material without disturbing the layup. But then it goes back into the bag for the complete cure under vacuum.
Posted on: 10/25/2009 2:33 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9199980

RE: Peel Ply
[quote]ORIGINAL: Ed Smith [quote]I have read somtimes this process is used to remove EXCESS epoxy and is only left on long enough to soak it up.[/quote] There is a difference between just removing excess resin and vacuum bagging. Vacuum bagging has a different purpose. If the object of the exercise is solely to remove excess resin then peel ply is a poor choice. It is fairly expensive and not very efficient, it is too thin. Paper towels or toilet paper are much cheaper and far more absorbant. Ed S [/quote] Hi Ed, The guys doing this are indeed using paper towels as the absorbant material but it is a pain to remove the toweling. So a layer of dress liner or peel ply could be used to ease the removal of the paper towel. They are putting this in a vacuum bag short term to maximize absorption with or without the use of peel ply. A single layer of of peelply or dressliner the size of a hand launch glider or even a Supra isn't to expensive IMHO compaired to Kevlar and CF[;)][:)]
Posted on: 10/24/2009 1:56 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9198606

RE: Peel Ply
Hey CP, I have made a few balsa over foam wings(AKA dry layup) and light even aplication of epoxy is (as you stated )the key. However I am refering to a FG/kevlar or CF (aka wet layup) over foam aplication. The technique of "drying the layup" in a vacuum bag with paper towels is a handlaunch builders trick to reduce weight. I think removing epoxy wet paper towels from the layup would be nuts. So a layer of peel ply between the layup and the paper towels. This really takes off extra epoxy to the point of needing to add a little back at the TE for strength before the final bagging with mylars on. Again I am talking off he top of my head here as I have not yet tried this. I got the info researching a Supra build in RCGroup's Thermal forum thread "another supra build -the slow way"... some very experienced builders. In this application the breather material will not absorb any epoxy except at the edges of the mylar. The final layer top and bottom is waxed (for removal afterwards) mylar that leaves the super smooth finish. This is a rather long thread but packed with info and techniques. Well worth a read IMHO.
Posted on: 10/24/2009 1:11 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9197700

RE: Peel Ply
I have read somtimes this process is used to remove EXCESS epoxy and is only left on long enough to soak it up. A quick removal of the peel ply is done WAY before the epoxy even thinks about setting up. Quick removal, before the viscous bond of epoxy, glass and foam is effected, is the key as I understand it. I have nottried it myself. It is a weight reduction technique.
Posted on: 10/22/2009 8:24 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9194534

RE: Peel Ply
Thanks for the clarification. very helpful. I take it any absorptive material, such as paper toweling, could be used over the peel ply. I assume you leave it in the vac bag just long enough to absorb the excesss epoxy. Then after this step apply painted mylar for final bagging?
Posted on: 10/22/2009 5:51 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9194186

RE: What do you recommend for a first slope plane?
Windrider Bee.
Posted on: 10/20/2009 12:23 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9187146

RE: Reconditioning an Ultra Stick
Nice work WP, My 60 Ultrastick is my favorite plane and it is being rebuilt as well. I am getting WAY to good at repairing! I never liked the original covering much, Top and bottom to much alike. Keep up the good work! Planes rairly are unfixable, sometimes after a couple of rebuilds we just want sumpin' different.
Posted on: 10/16/2009 10:39 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Crash & Rebuild"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9179396

RE: Carbon fiber tailboom layup question.
it. OzMo
Posted on: 10/15/2009 12:34 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9174255

RE: One wing landing
I landed my old Pro Twister on one wing the otherday.....But I can fix it![;)][;)]
Posted on: 10/14/2009 12:03 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "3D Flying!"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9171581

RE: Vacuum pump
There is a capacitor in the ac unit that helps start the motor. I am also setting up an airconditoner/ joewoodworker.com vac system. I tried running the motor without the capacitor and it had that soft hum, reconected the capacitor and it runs like a sewing machine. Walmart $7.00 heavy clear shower curtains make nice bags!Wally also sells clear vinyl in variuos thicknesses in the fabric shop. 100% polyester "backing" is good for the tranfers "felt". Joewoodworker.com has a downloadable schematic in the direction for his system BTW. [quote]ORIGINAL: robert Hi, Thanks for the great answers. I found a vacuum swith on ebay and it works great. My last hurdle is now some of the wiring going into the motor which I can't figure out. I have the switch placed in the old thermostat leads. It cuts the power as needed. The problem starts though when the motor stops. The pressure switch switches the power back on (after 30 seconds or so) but something prevents the motor starting. A soft humming noise comes from somewhere that I can't pinpoint, and after about 10 seconds a bimetallic fuse type thing clicks, cutting the power to the motor off completely. The bi-metallic strip then cools, clicks back into place, and the motor starts. Does anyone have any idea what is preventing the power going to the motor? And more importantly, why does it do it? I thought it kept the power off if the motor temperature was too hot but it happens when the motor is hot or cold. I have made a resevoir and while its slowed down the leak rate, it still needs topping off before the motor wants to start running again. Anyone have any ideas? If I can't get the pressure switch plan work, I suppose I'll just use my bleed air screw to adjust the pressure and run the motor non stop for the whole curing process, hopefully it won't burn out?!?!?!? Thanks! Robert. [/quote]
Posted on: 10/13/2009 8:09 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9107160

Carbon fiber tailboom layup question.
Hi, Old time modler first time composite guy here. I am going to try my hand at laying up a CF boom for a Supra. (Actaully scratching the whole plane). I have a few questions. A) use the .005 prepreg CF and bake it at 250 degrees with shrink tape over the lay up (ala Mark Drela)or B ) use Regular CF and epoxy and Bag it. ( vacuum system almost done!) I also would like to know about peel ply, I understand 100 percent polyester is the same stuff. Is the finest weave or lightest weight you can get the better? FYI I found Sweet super clear vinyl in different weights (for making furniture slips etc) and "backer" that is same as breather strips at Wally World.
Posted on: 10/13/2009 8:05 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9164477

RE: Value of Vacuum Bagging
Heavy duty super clear vinyl (used to cover furniture etc.) is sold in several thicknesses in Walmart fabric depts. So is the "felt" breather material, its 100% polyester "backing" and comes on fabric bolts also in different thicknesses. Both can be had by the yard.
Posted on: 10/10/2009 12:44 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9161697

RE: What does it take to get an old bird flying?
I second the "all new gas lines" INCLUDING the clunk tube in the tank and possibly the tank stopper. O rings for the carb/needle valve. This is one of the usual sources for head aches with older planes. Be very careful with old batteries!
Posted on: 10/10/2009 12:07 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Beginners"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9161629

RE: Best Kv Choice for Easy Glider E with stock Gearbox?
aeajr, Let us know what you end up with in the Mantis please. Several guys at our field have been using hobbyking.com motors with very good results.
Posted on: 10/7/2009 10:37 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9155354

RE: Best Kv Choice for Easy Glider E with stock Gearbox?
Hey aeajr, "Watt" 3 meter bird are you planning on? I hope to build an electric fuse for the Supra I want to build this winter. Bagging stuff arived, just have to finish building the wife's new front porch then I can get going on it!
Posted on: 10/5/2009 5:31 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9149090

RE: Bowed aileron
Hi You'll get a more specific response if you tell 'em what the plane IE the aileron is made from. Pictures are always helpful too. Balsa might respond to reheating the covering while holding oposite warp let it cool before releasing. But as this is the "composite " forum it well may have been built crooked and it is what it is. If it became crooked in storage then storing it with oposite warp may help. Some epoxy softens with heat so heating it with oposite warp and allowing to cool before releasing may work here as well.
Posted on: 9/28/2009 1:33 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9129088

RE: Vacuum pump
Hi Gang, Today I found just the air tank from an old small compressor at a garage sale. 6" dia. x 20" long. And it has all the appropriate threads for the fittings. [8D] $2.00 ...SWEET! Perfect for a vacuum resevoir. I bought the Joe woodworker set for guages etc. I will assemble it on the next day the weather is to bad for flying.
Posted on: 9/25/2009 10:01 PM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Composites Fabrication And Repair"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9124381

RE: Besst Food for RC Flyer's, How to Get It
We have a sneaky suspicion that the BEEf from the cows that keep gettin into our field and making "pies" would be right tasty! Ever to to get cow pie out of wheel pants[:'(] I think a BBQ to make an example of one would work [;)]
Posted on: 9/9/2009 2:19 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Classic Pattern Flying"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9080827

RE: PIGGYBACK LAUNCH CRADLE PICS
The Senior can take a lot more engine than is specified so it depends a little on what gliders you want to tote. An OS 91 fx weighs around 1 ounce more than an OS 61 fx so I went with the 91fx, a similar weight engine should be fine. 2 meter gliders on piggy back should be fine as well. I made every thing a little heavy duty in mine. increased rudder and elevator surfaces as needed. Arrow shaft push rods that go throught the fuse very close to the rudder and elevator with heavier guage short wire ends for stiffness. Heavy duty servo arms and control horns. 1100 Mah 6v battery. Alum landing gear rated for 10 to 14 lb plane. Large low bounce wheels (old dubro). 1" dia. tail wheel and such. Reinforce well around wing mount area as you will be doing double duty there. I like to call mine an air truck. Take care to mount the piggy back craddle so the glider CG is over the plane's, and with just a smidge of negative attitude so the glider's wing lift is negated during the climb. This also helps to make the release gentler. The most important thing however is HAVE FUN[:)]
Posted on: 9/9/2009 2:10 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9080815

RE: man made slopes
Dam...wish I had thought of that[;)][:D] I have heard of some light indoor birds flying off of electric fan lift.
Posted on: 9/9/2009 1:48 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "RC Gliders, Sailplanes and Slope Soaring"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9080788

RE: small generator
Yep just upgrade the car battery and get a nice inverter. less hassle and your car will start better in the winter[;)][;)]
Posted on: 9/9/2009 1:46 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Beginners"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9080784

RE: Balance, way tail heavy
[quote]ORIGINAL: jib [quote]ORIGINAL: jaka Some foam under the Spektrum receiver wouldn't be bad either! [/quote] He has it mounted on velcro. That what I use and it will be enough shock absorbing material for a 2.4 receiver. At least that's what Spektrum says. Jack [/quote] I use the egg drop route. I want to be able to drop the egg(RX) from the roof and still have it intact. But its his money out for a new one. Scrap foam from a computer or electonics store is free. I have had my share of crashes but never lost a reciever from impact. I still have a working Ace Silver Seven. Ok so now you know I have done this for a little while[;)]
Posted on: 9/9/2009 1:41 AM by Author "OzMo" in the forum "Beginners"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9080779