RE: Palmer 132
C-130fan, Fuel is weight. When you start getting into this kind of expense and effort, you need to start thinking backups and redundancy. If I was considering the cost and additional complications of turboprops, I would want cross feeding and reserve tanks. Not to mention the redundancy of servos, RXs, power regulation, etc. (the list goes on). The cost for a bird that size could easily exceed $10 - $15k. The version I am building is very close to $10K and it is electric. You see on the net plenty of examples of expensive birds being converted into scrap due to mistakes and short sightedness. The Zinger prop would be short for the 22' bird. For scale you would need a 27" which is the max size for the JetCat Turboprop (I believe). The resulting thrust to weight ratio be be far higher than fighters (approx >3:1). Ever seen a C-130 stand on its tail?[X(] [X(] [X(] Honestly I think it would be a real crowd pleaser but not very practical unless you had bottomless pockets. Dave
Posted on: 6/6/2010 2:05 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9784920

RE: Palmer 132
C-130fan, I (along with several others I am sure) have given turbo props at least a glancing thought. Some of the obvious downsides .... 1) With a full size Prop Assy. of 13.5 feet, this would result in a scale bird of 22' wing span and approx. 18' feet in length. 2) Takeoff weight of approx 60 to 70 lbs or more. 2) Fuel consumption would require at least 180 oz in order to give this bird any practical air time. 3) At approx $5,000.00 per engine ................... 4) Props would be a ball to make - I am custom building the Dowty R391 6 blade for my bird. Hell with all the money we crazy folks are putting into these birds already, why not break the banks (and our marriages). [:)] [:)] [:)]
Posted on: 6/5/2010 10:25 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9783671

RE: Palmer 132
Hi all, If I remember my time in the Canadian Forces working around the C130, the stripe up the side of the fusealage is to identify the maximum turning angle for the nose gear when the bird is being towed by a mule. You make sure you do not rotate the nose gear so the tow bar goes past the line. Dave
Posted on: 5/19/2010 8:25 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9745618

RE: Palmer 132
Hi Gary, Several of us in this forum got our kits from Precision Cut Kits. These kits are Dan Palmer Plans and have quite a few errors in them which PCK seems content not to correct. If you read through the whole forum (cover to cover) you should be forewarned enough to take a stab at the PCK kit. There are not that many kits out there to choose from. If you do not mind the additional engineering and tinkering it is not a bad kit. I have found it an easy kit to modify. The kit comes as an empty shell H model and I am stuffing it with all the goodies (flight deck, cargo floor, cargo rails, fully working para doors, the list goes on and on) and turning it into a J-30 Super Herc (stretched). Dave
Posted on: 3/20/2010 12:42 AM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9596745

RE: Palmer 132
Sam, The standard C-130J is the same length as the C-130H (Palmer Plans). The C-130J-30 Super Hercules is the stretch version. Dave
Posted on: 3/19/2010 4:46 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9595638

RE: Palmer 132
Sam, If I can get the blades to work the yes it will be converted to a C-130J Super Hercules - CF scheme with all the bells, whistles and trimmings.
Posted on: 3/19/2010 2:36 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9595329

RE: Palmer 132
Sam, Right now I am looking at E-flite Power BL90 and the Castle Creations HV85. Our club President will help me with the machining. I haven't decided on the fabrication method for the props yet. lots of options. The hub assy will be very easy to reproduce. A six blade version will be the fun part but would be really cool. Dave
Posted on: 3/19/2010 2:02 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9595249

RE: Palmer 132
Hi Sam, Glad to hear you are back home and progressing. Let's try this again. Here is the page that got me started with this idea. http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1200180&page=16 (post #229). I am thinking if I am going to try the custom prop route I will also try fabricating the R391 (6 blade version) blade. This should be fun. Dave
Posted on: 3/19/2010 1:23 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9595137

RE: Palmer 132
greeter896, I am doing my version as a stretch and with full electrics. I will also be doing my prop assy as a variation of Richard Malinowskis' variable pitch prop http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJDdpaHEZMs. Richards' assy is fullly variable and uses the trainer switch to switch to reverse. It is quite simple in its design and should be very effective. I am looking into designing and building my own scale props. I have a several ideas for this and will be testing over the coming months. My plan at present is to use 90 size electrics at 29.6v. MotoCalc tells me this birdy should be great for 3D lol. Dave
Posted on: 3/19/2010 11:33 AM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9594914

RE: Palmer 132
Chris, Where abouts over Norway. I was stationed in Norway (northern half) for a NATO exercise back in the eighties. I sent you a PM. Dave
Posted on: 2/21/2010 11:55 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9524834

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, Anytime. We are all in this together. Well ... time to marry off the daughter [:D][:(] (daughter getting married today). Dave
Posted on: 12/4/2009 11:31 AM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9303054

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, This could get interesting for me. I will need a ground adjusted variable pitch. The math has my blades being 13.5"x11.25". This produces the best results for my set up. I will need the ability to make adjustments during test runs on the engines. Depending on my cargo load for a flight there may be an adjustment as well. Dave PS. I have emailed Hamilton Sundstrom ( new owners of Hamilton Standard) for any help they may be able to provide us with.
Posted on: 12/3/2009 10:39 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9302052

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, I am very intrigued in the idea of reserrecting these props. Depending on price , I may be interested in these as an alternative to the props I plan on presently. The main question for me is whether they will be useable with electrics. I will be sticking with electrics so if these porps will work with electrics, I am interested. I have done all the math and talked with the vendors involved and electrics will work very well with this model (if anyone else is interested). Is Highland Systems Int'l using specs and plans from Hamilton Standard? Dave
Posted on: 12/3/2009 4:40 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9301041

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, I would think of building in a wood frame for securing the servos. Obviously trying to secure the servo to the foam will not work (for long). Dave
Posted on: 11/26/2009 7:23 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9283352

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, Ok ... Where to start. 1) Foam core Stabs. There should be no problem as long as you can make sure they are strong enough to do the job. If you want removeable foam core stabs, you will need to create mounting compartments for the servos. All removeable "planes" (wings, stabs, tail) will need to have the servos built in with the wiring through a connector. If you can get the foam core version to accomplish all the same aspects as the full wood versions why shouldn't it work? If the weight is much less than wood version, you will need to adjust your weight to keep the CoG. 2) Total rebuild. You definitely can use the plans to create all new parts. Strong suggestion to save you a lot of grief. Cut the pieces as you go. Don't cut all the pieces first and then start assembly. When cutting multiple copies, try cutting one to check the fit. Adjust as needed to get it to fit properly and then use the corrected part as your template for all the other parts. Be sure to double check your alignment and trueness as you go. It is very easy to get this bird twisted without realizing it. Again ... cut a piece and then check it for fit. Some of the parts in this bird are not included in the plans. If you are going to start over save the old build for parts to cut out and use to create templates when needed. One big advantage of starting over is you can also make the whole wings and tail removeable if you want (like mine). Also the stretch version if you like. Dave
Posted on: 11/24/2009 9:29 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9278578

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, Here is a pic of my flight deck. I think the colours may help. Dave
Posted on: 11/11/2009 9:28 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9247352

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, These are 2 that I have found. All the best trying to replicate this. I figure on doing a "sort of job" following the functions.
Posted on: 11/1/2009 8:55 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9221200

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, HAPPY B_DAY [:D][:D][:D] Well it's official. The family got nailed - me included. oink oink. [:(][:(][:(] You are right. I think I will stop now. No more additions to the plane. I was doing more thinking on the subject of the JATO. If any of the bottles break loose, it could set the fuselage alight. No good. Not to mention the rules regarding airborne pyros. Try thinking of mounting all the antenaes on removable panels with replacement blank panels. That way you can have 2 versions to fly. Dave
Posted on: 10/29/2009 10:37 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9213904

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever Nice idea for the EC 130. Have you thought of how you are going to make the outboard wing pods? I have decided to add the KC 130 option to mine. It will have the drogue extend and retract from the pod. That part I still have to figure out. I took a picture of the wing tank in the plans, resized it in the computer and printed. I think I had better hurry up and finish this bird before this bird ends up with all options and can't get off the ground. LOL Check your email for my thoughts on the other issue. Dave
Posted on: 10/28/2009 9:04 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9210742

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, The pictures clear up a lot of head scratching from when we last talked. Great work. Looks like you and Mike were very successful. The 3/4" tube should work just great. I see what you were talking about regarding the flight deck. Major work. Looks like you are going to win there as well. Could just be me but I am seeing a very bright light at the end of your tunnel. I think you are going to win this one. Yeah!!! It is looking like you have a firm grasp on all the enheritted problems and hopefully near the end. Dave
Posted on: 10/12/2009 12:48 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9166688

RE: Palmer 132
Olsen, Welcome to the C 130 Hercules Insane Asylum where all come in but none get out. [sm=spinnyeyes.gif] We have all had issues and fun and games with this build. If in doubt ..... YELLL [sm=drowning.gif] A lot of us are modifying our birds to match one version or another. Feel free. I too am leaning towards electric. I have worked out all the math and it looks great. 4 bladed props with tonnes of pull. Capable of 3D (if I was that stupid [sm=bananahead.gif]). If you are thinking of 4 stroke, take a look at RCV's RCV90 SP. Dave
Posted on: 9/22/2009 9:29 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9116543

RE: Palmer 132
Hi Everyone, Quick question. I have been going through all my paperwork for this build and discovered I am missing page 14 from the instruction manual that came with the kit. Could someone please email me a copy of page 14? Thanks Dave
Posted on: 9/17/2009 6:37 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9103880

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, As long as you make your brace cover enough surface area of the existing halves, you should be just fine. If you make the brace out of something stronger than balsa this will work the best (light ply or something). Dave
Posted on: 9/15/2009 10:25 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9099064

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, 1) PCK does not have the best reputation for after sale service. Several of the forum gang have had no post sale service at all. Don't hold your breath. If you do get connected with them, be very carefull if they offer you a wing kit. There is no option for that on their website. Make sure they understand it is for the 132" version. They offer smaller versions and I think it was Wolfgang in Germany who odered they 132" and got the 1/18th scale plans. They would not exchange the plans. They told him to scale the plans up himself. They also looked like crap as well. 2) I found instructions on how to work washout into a wing. http://www.rcfctoronto.ca/washout.html All the calculations and such. It discusses the different methods of building washout into a wing. Please read carefully. It talks about building the washout in and not trying to add after (twisting the wing). This is very risky and has a very high probabley of error bewteen the wings and having the angle change over time. The instructions in the link are very easy. I found it very easy to build the washout in at build time. 3) If you are going to replace the one half of the former, I would suggest at some point you need to have a complete piece covering both halves. Reinforcing each have will create a weak spot at the joint. You should cover the joint with that complete piece. I have done this in a couple of places. If the above link does not work let me know and I can give you another link. Dave
Posted on: 9/15/2009 8:48 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9098717

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, Do you have a picture of the "half former" you are refering to? It is easier to make a suggestion if I can see what you are talking about. Dave
Posted on: 9/15/2009 5:42 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9098239

RE: TWIN, INLINE, DUCTED FAN'S = TWICE THE TAILPIPE VELOCITY?
I understand what you are getting at. I think it is time to go back to the drawing board (and the basics of propulsion, etc.). One of the big hurdles I see is the issue of simulating the rapid pressure increase as a result of combustion in the combustion chamber. I can simulate the rest of the engine but how to simulate the effect of the burner. I think this is an interesting idea. How to get the maximum velocity out of a Ducted Fan based Turbojet engine. Lots of research to do. I will be back with more once I learn more. Dave
Posted on: 9/15/2009 3:25 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Aerodynamics"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9097942

RE: TWIN, INLINE, DUCTED FAN'S = TWICE THE TAILPIPE VELOCITY?
Hello, I have been looking around for others who have the same thought as I. 2 stage ducted fan engine. I have had some feed back on this idea. What I have been told is to make the size ratio between the stages at leats 1.5:1 or more and the speed ratio at least 1:2 or more. This will create (somewhat) the efface of a High Bypass compressor out of stage 1. Stage 2 would be the turbine section. Both DFs would be electric and driven by their own ESCs and batteries. Identical ESCs would allow the DFs to stay together through the power range on the throttle. The exhaust nozzle would need to be variable and driven off a servo from the throttle channel. This will allow the exhaust pressure to vary with the throttle settings as in a real turbojet engine. Just for a laugh I have created a concept picture. The "Booster" would be ignited for short field use and would only be ignitable at full throttle (hence exhaust nozzle open fully as in AB position). Love to hear peoples thought. Please feel free to laugh. I also live by the principle "Never know unless you try". Dave
Posted on: 9/13/2009 2:22 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Aerodynamics"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9092134

RE: Off the wall EDF idea
Ok I told you this was off the wall. How about really off the wall!!!!!! I would love feedback on the following picture. Imagine 2 of these engines in a 93" long F4 Phanton. Works really great or blows it to pieces.[:D] Dave
Posted on: 9/10/2009 11:11 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9085792

RE: Palmer 132
Hi everyone, Is it just me or is everyone missing page 14 of the instruction manual (Rudder, Elevators and Fuselage Stringers). Dave
Posted on: 9/10/2009 5:49 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9084935

RE: Palmer 132
Props4ever, Here are some pics of the wing jig. It is 20" deep. The walls are 4" tall and 2" respectively. The notches are 2" by 4.5". They match up to the placement of the engine nacelles.
Posted on: 9/9/2009 5:22 PM by Author "dmcconneyherc" in the forum "Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9082197