RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello all, I have finally put together my 301 kit as an "American Airlines" jet but have not flown it yet. After this assembly I have discovered a few issues which I will fix before attempting the first flight. For that I will disassemble the fuselage, make a few modifications (especially the undercarriage), re-do the main retracts (current carbon fiber-based assembly will be replaced by aluminum) and the clear passenger windows will be secured using a stronger glue. I will post more pictures when I am done. I took some pictures of the model before I start the disassembly/assembly. Cheers, Serdar
Posted on: 5/3/2008 5:49 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=7452120

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello Ian, The main purpose of real windows is cabin lighting. It will be a 20cm long, ultra slim fluorescent bulb powered by a mini ballast at 6V. The light output is just right to provide a realistic glow during a night flight. The only remaining action is to paint the inner fuselage to eliminate light glowing through the fuselage walls. Serdar
Posted on: 11/22/2006 7:34 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=5028311

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Here is a close-up image of the holes on the front fuselage section. Holes are cut using a home made device which is an attachment to a low temperature covering iron. Serdar
Posted on: 11/19/2006 10:52 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=5016272

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Folks, I have completed which I have been planning for some time: drilled the holes for all windows on the fuselage skins. There will be a thin, transparent layer behind the holes, when I finish the fuselage assembly. I am making slow progress but I move forward, I will keep posting pictures. Thanks Serdar NOTE: The holes are exactly the same shape and size, and they are perfectly clean with no jagged edges. I have made the pictures small so that they upload faster. That is why the picture quality is very poor and the holes look as if they have jagged edges.
Posted on: 11/19/2006 8:29 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=5016227

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
[quote]ORIGINAL: jwalsh1 ... and do 3 EDF in that. pricey though, maybe cheaper to go with one turbine instead. [/quote] If you choose turbine, check out BMT. Propane no longer needed. Serdar
Posted on: 8/23/2006 8:48 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4661276

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hi All, In Germany there is a guy by the name Peter Michel (http://www.michel-concorde.de/index2.html) who builds and flies awesome airliners. If I remember correctly he started by using Norbert Rauch's plans (http://rauch-airliner.com/). However these are NOT like Ian's kits. First off they are fiberglass, balsa and for turbine power. Peter Michel's Boeing 747 (Lufthansa livery) is an awesome 60kg (132lb!!!!). In my humble opinion, if you are building airliners for the looks and performance, and if you are not planning to spend the money for a kit that costs as much as a brand new Mercedes-Benz, then build Ian's planes. That said, just for the fun of it, check out Peter's and Norbert's Web sites. Serdar
Posted on: 8/21/2006 11:17 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4652627

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello, Tamiya has a huge selection of colors. Check out http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/category.php?sub-id=61500 for color selections. You may also buy the paint online at http://www.towerhobbies.com/. I am also for scale looks. More than the extra lift, I have built the fowler flaps for scale looks. No matter how you slice it, any additional feature may add weight to the model. Furthermore, watch for the additional drag. Keep us informed of your progress. Any pictures would be greatly appreciated. Serdar
Posted on: 7/18/2006 9:17 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4517950

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello Dave, Yours will become the next Southwest after mine, but in fact you may finish earlier than mine, since I have barely enough time to eat and sleep. As for the color scheme, I recommend TAMIYA TS-57 FOR BLUE, TS-8 FOR RED AND TS-56 FOR ORANGE. I have searched a lot for the correct Southwest colors and indeed found them from Krylon but the quality of TAMIYA is for superior to Krylon's. For the landing gear struts, I used Robart's plastic strut covers. If you are planning to add retracts, I must warn you that it will take a ton of work since you must change the wing assembly to make room for the retracts. Also you may purchase a servo delay unit for realism. Let me know if I can help. I have made a lot of changes to the plan to accomodate my extras and learned a great deal as to what to do and what not to do. Serdar
Posted on: 7/15/2006 6:17 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4505227

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
I loved the little RR logo on the side! It is cute. As for my 301 Southwest I am still far from finishing it, while we are busy building parts for the SDO[1]. Most recently, I have assembled the main and nose retracts, rudder control and a few electrical stuff related for navigation lights. Serdar [1] SDO is NASA's Solar Dynamic Observatory satellite, to be launched in 2008 to study the Sun and replace the to-be-retired SOHO Satellite.
Posted on: 6/23/2006 1:54 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4419983

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Awesome work, looking great. Serdar
Posted on: 6/14/2006 11:35 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4392110

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Thanks Ian, The picture made everything crystal clear. I have also noticed that the engine you are showing is using a fan with a singe-fin tail cone. My Alfa fans has dual fins. Therefore, for the shown assembly, I relalize that I must shave the tip of the tail-cone-fin to fit into the cowl. Serdar p.s. I have found a way to contruct the main retracts using carbon fiber material instead of aluminum. The model may weigh the same as the basic kit, despite all the additionsl We shall see...
Posted on: 5/1/2006 9:47 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4229766

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Ian, I have your detailed installation instructions for the flat-bottom engine cowls but when I install the inner tail pipe inside the main cowl, the air flow is pointing up rather than down which I was assuming. In other words the inner tail pipe is touching the top end of the cowl exhaust leaving a gap at the lower end of the exhaust. The ribs on the tail pipe is causing this, unless of course I should be sculpting the tail pipe so that it would be perfectly centered inside the cowl. What is the expected orientation of the tail pipe, a picture (if you have it would help even better). Serdar
Posted on: 5/1/2006 1:22 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4227804

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Mr. Z is not only a great builder, but a great photographer as well. Looks extremely realistic, except the see-through :) jet engines. Serdar
Posted on: 5/1/2006 1:16 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4227781

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Coffee in the cabin, but of course. Currently building the tiny paper cups for that. :) Serdar
Posted on: 4/30/2006 4:29 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4224198

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Thanks much. I will look them up. So far I was unable to find anything that is realistic enough, but these guys may have them. On my DC-3 (http://kolejliler.netfirms.com) I have finally decided to design and build my own lights and they work just as I want them. The red fin light is a slow flasher, the aft fuselage white strobe goes exatly like a xenon, a very bright but fast flash. The green/red navigation lights are static, no flash. The landing lights are halogen bulbs and they turn on when the gears are down. For the 301 kit, I have the following planned: Two red strobes flashing once per second but not synchronous to each other (intentionally). Three white leds, very flast flashing, simulating xenon; two on aft wing tips one on the aft fuselage tip. Greed/red static lights on wing tips;Three white leds inside the cabin. That is why my 301 has transparent windows instead of decals. And finally three halogen lights, two on the wings and one on the nose gear. Serdar
Posted on: 4/30/2006 4:28 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4221601

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Thanks much, I will check Google for Go-Slo by McDaniel RC. Serdar
Posted on: 4/29/2006 10:09 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4221572

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
No significant progress on my Southwest jet. I have resolved the issues with the motor, fan selection. After major surgery, I was able to fit the Mega 16/7/4 motors into the ALFA 1502 Mega fans. I have also assembled the cowls and currently sculpting the cowl seams using a Tamiya polyester putty so that the seams would be totally invisible. I am glad you have mentioned about the need for rotor balancing, I was assuming that the rotors have been pre-balanced. Learned a new thing. Your previous message about Mr. Z's model caught my attention. I have long been thinking about how to slow down the retract mechanism until i read yuor message about the delay module. However, I was unable to locate the module on the internet, but I have gotten another idea on how to delay the mechanism, I need to experiment first to see if it works... Well, I will post pictures whenever I have something to show, so far the wings look exactly as I have posted a few weeks earlier. Cheers, Serdar
Posted on: 4/29/2006 11:20 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4219784

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Great job. Does the model have lights? Serdar
Posted on: 4/28/2006 5:04 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4217277

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
My 301 assembly is moving, yet very slowly. This weekend I have assembled the wing and the winglets. I have installed the navigational lights and the white strobes (facing back at the wingtip). Also the landing lights (halogen) have been installed. The lights have their own reflector and are focused forward but the cylindrical holes are also covered with chrome to enable the lights to illuminate sideways also. Since I have extended the wing length, I thought I might as well shape the new wingtips, go thinner as I move towards the end, add a 105 degrees bend and blend it with the foam-board winglets. Of course the new section is reinforced but still flexible. The wires for lighting go through aluminum pipes which double as reinforcing struts inside the foam wing extensions. A big part of the mid-section has been removed and the carbon plates have been re-shaped to make room for the retractable gears. Naturally the aluminum chassis for the gears can not be used, but a newly shaped aluminum part will be used. Next is the assembly of the flaps, ailerons and applying the wing skins. I will use brushed chrome all through the wings (same material in the kit is for the leading edges of the wing). I have also experimented with real aluminum (kitchen wrap) and got outstanding realism. I used a special plastic spray (water based) which makes styrofoam solvent proof, which is essential if you want to use real aluminum. This requires extreme care (it is easy to wrinkle aluminum) and a lot of time, which I do not have. But if you like to learn more, please drop me an email at elk75_serdar@yahoo.com. More to come... Serdar
Posted on: 4/19/2006 2:21 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4173706

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Carbon spars are in there, aluminum is for the extended wing tips. I could have used brass (more flexible) but I needed lesser weight. Serdar
Posted on: 4/19/2006 8:47 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4181878

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Guys, Don't worry about the landing, it will land one way or the other. Noone has ever left a plane in the air. :) Serdar
Posted on: 4/11/2006 11:39 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4152816

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Ian, I agree with you 100%, especially the design is so clean and easy to assemble yet eye pleasing. I wish you had a larger model that could carry a wireless camera for aerial video broadcast. Serdar
Posted on: 4/11/2006 8:21 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4147003

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Orville! it will not fly!! You have forgotten to add a wing to this aircraft! :) Serdar
Posted on: 4/10/2006 10:16 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4147011

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello All, The construction of my 301 is a little behind schedule since I was busy with my engineering job (putting food on the table and paying for this hobby). Hiowever, I have completed the conceptual design and constructed the parts I would need to for the assembly. [color=#FF0000]IMPORTANT NOTE: THE ORIGINAL 301 KIT DOES NOT REQUIRE ANY CHANGES. I AM SIMPLY EXPERIMENTING WITH A FEW IDEAS AND I WILL CONSIDER MYSELF LUCKY IF THE MODEL STILL FLIES AFTER ALL THE THINGS I HAVE CHANGED SO FAR.[/color] Back to the subject: The modified 301 kit will have fowler flaps (two split flaps on each side, and I have managed to do so by adding no more than 5 oz to the overall weight. Another change is the modified winglet design. I have also added 50 sqin to the overall wing area compensating for all the additions, maintaining the original wing loading. Well, stay tuned to see it before April is out. Serdar
Posted on: 4/6/2006 9:46 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4133919

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello Ian, Thank you for your prompt response. I am NOT changing the main gear locations, and adding all additional hardware within the center line (parallel to the wing). The additional weight associated with the split elevator design will be counter balanced by the additonal servo for the extending flaps. The purpose is to minimize the need for additional dead-weight to balance the model. I have also designed the stabilizer/elevator to maintain the original stabilizer surface control for the coarse adjustment of the stabilizer plane. In other words, I will be able to change the angle of incidence of the combined stabilizer/elevator all together. So, if the elevator is down (say 10 degrees), then if I adjust the stabilizer up (say 5 degrees), the entire structure will move up by 5 degrees, while maintaining the relative 10 degree position of the elevator with respect to the stabilizer. So what if I set the stabilizer incorrectly and crash the plane: I hope the following step will help me save my hardwork: For the initial flight, I will set the flaps at 0 degrees (fully retracted) and will temporarily glue them. I will use the flap servo to control the stabilizer (similar to the original kit), while maintaining the separate elevator control. I will set the (temporary stabilizer) servo for 0 degrees During the first few flights, I will adjust the stabilizer for level flight (if needed) and then measure the angle of incidence upon landing. This will provide the chance to fine tune the plane's attitude and handling. Once set, I will return the flap controls and set the stabilizer permanently. Cheers Serdar
Posted on: 3/14/2006 11:04 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4033405

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Hello Ian, It is great to see your vote of confidence on all the changes I am making. I would be a liar if I tell you I am not deeply concerned about the changes, since the only way to find out if I messed up is by flying the plane, and by then, it would be too late. The biggest concern/unknown at this time is the angle of incidence of the stabilizer. Since I am making the leading edge fixed, I better get it right, or the plane may climb too steep or nose dive, especially with the smaller elevator surfaces. Could you please recommend the angle of incidence of the stabilizer for level flight when the elevators are level with the stabilizer plane? Can I assume that the stabilizer should also have a 1 degree incidence like the wings? Also could you please remind me of the CG, since the changes I have made have already changed it, and as such I need to return it to its original place. Please note that my model would be using the Alfa fans. Thanks Serdar
Posted on: 3/13/2006 11:02 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4031152

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
To re-iterate the point which Ian is making: The Original EDF Models do NOT use balsa. The original kit is PERFECTLY fine to build and fly an outstanding aircraft. In fact adding balsa to the model would make it heavier and unless you are experimenting like myself, I would NOT recommend it. The 301 kit I am assembling is an experimental model, which is being assembled more like a display model, rather than a kit one would fly at the park on the weekend. Although, it will still be flight worthy, it is NOT as robust as the original 301kit; in a crash, the original kit would likely survive with a few scratches, but my plane will almost certainly disintegrate. For those of you out there, please be warned: I am NOT recommending any changes to the kit. The original design is excellent and does not need any changes at all. Serdar
Posted on: 3/13/2006 10:42 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4028110

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
My 301 contruction is in progress. I have not yet started assembling the fuselage, since I have been busy with the wings. I have changed the plan a little bit for a scale look while trying to maintain the flight characteristics of the finished model. There is one little exception: I have changed the elevator design and split the stabilizer from the elevators. This will change the controllability of the model (will make it less responsive). Attached are photos for the contruction in progress: The fin with the rudder The stabilizer with the split elevators The wing with a slighly modified aileron and extending split flaps The pylon (balsa) which will house the servo arm and rails for the carbon fiber flap connection rods I have also added the drawing of the extending flaps for those of you who might be interested. As you can see, when the flap extends, it will move away from the wing and also downwards. In a fully extended state, it will be 1 inch away from the wing and 15 degrees (from the wing bottom). It works as follows: The flaps are connected to two rods (carbon). Each rod goes through one of the slits on the pylon. When the servo arm pushes the flap, the rods make it move in the desired position. Well there is no other drawing to clarify but you got the idea... Cheers Serdar
Posted on: 3/13/2006 12:32 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=4026886

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Thanks for the tips on wheels Ian. One quick question: Measuring from the fuselage bottom and wing bottom surfaces to ground respectively, what should be the height of the nose and main gears so that the 1 degree incidence angle can be obtained (using the wheels that come in the kit)? I will recalculate the same for 1 3/4 wheels. Serdar
Posted on: 3/1/2006 12:08 AM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=3975074

RE: EDF Airliner build thread
Ian, About the Frontier decals: One little detail caught my attention. The port holes on the doors are still gray. Do you not want to convert those to black? Serdar
Posted on: 2/28/2006 10:58 PM by Author "serdark" in the forum "Electric RC Jets"
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=3974750